Matthew Fairbrother - What is the limit?

He’s the kind of rider who sees a mountain range, a race calendar, or a line on a map and immediately starts wondering what’s possible.

Matthew Fairbrother joins us to talk about the mindset that’s taken him from a young racer in New Zealand to one of mountain biking’s most unique endurance adventurers. Whether it’s riding between Enduro World Series rounds across Europe, climbing over 10,000 vertical metres in a day, taking on the Tour du Mont Blanc, or creating self-supported challenges that seem impossible on paper, Matthew has built a reputation for choosing the harder path simply because he’s curious where it leads.

This conversation isn’t really about distance, elevation, or race results. It’s about chasing progress, learning through discomfort, and finding satisfaction in working toward something that genuinely excites you. We dive into the highs and lows of ultra-endurance riding, the mental strategies Matthew uses when things get tough, and why breaking a massive challenge into smaller goals can make the impossible feel achievable.

We also explore his evolution from a shy teenager travelling Europe alone to someone actively seeking out new cultures, experiences, and adventures. Along the way, we discuss self-supported racing, bikepacking, content creation, and why, at the core of it all, Matthew still sees every bike as simply a tool for the next adventure.

Share it with your riding crew, hit follow, and tell us where you want to ride, the next chapter starts right now.

• Get in touch via my Instagram
• Hosted and Produced by Jarrad Connolly

Transcript

Welcome And Why Adventure Matters

Jarrad 0:00

Today's guest is someone who is refining what mountain biking can look like. While most riders say a race course, Matt Fairbrother says an adventure. Whether it's climbing over 10,000 vertical meters in 24 hours, riding between the Enduro World Series rounds, taking on the tour de Mont Blanc on a bike or self-supported expedition. Matters build a reputation for choosing the harder path simply to see what's possible. But this conversation isn't really about the numbers, the distance, or the elevation about the game. It's about what drives someone to keep pushing further when no one is asking them to. Why suffering can be rewarding, why uncertainty can be exciting. And what you learn about yourself when you're on the bike alone for hours, days, or even weeks at a time. We dive into adventure, endurance, racing, risk, and the mindset that has taken Matt from a young racer in New Zealand to one of the most interesting figures in mountain biking today. This conversation is about pushing the limits, chasing curiosity, and finding the meaning through adventure. Please welcome Matt Fairbrother to the Dynamic Life Cycles Podcast. About 70% of the people watching and listening to this aren't subscribed, which basically means two things.

Five Laps On The North Shore

Jarrad 2:10

Alright, Matt, how are you? I'm good, thank you. How are you? Pretty good, pretty good.

Matt 2:14

How's your uh your ride down? It was a bit savage. Uh massive headwind the whole way, so yeah, punishing, but yeah, not a not a bad place to spend the day on the bike.

Jarrad 2:26

Yeah, definitely. And it was nice and warm out there today as well.

Matt 2:30

Yeah, cold start, got a bit wet, but now it's uh yeah, the sun's come out and started to get a bit hot. Yeah. So all seasons today.

Jarrad 2:38

Yeah, definitely. Um I have to ask, what are you doing in Vancouver at the moment?

Matt 2:43

Um came here with the goal to do a mission, uh, which I ticked off last week, and yeah, now just hanging about. Yeah, nice. And can you talk about that mission? Um yeah, so I guess here in Vancouver on the North Shore, there's a few mountains, and there's an iconic mission to um basically go to the top of each mountain. Um, and I went and did that multiple times in in one day just to see how many times I could do it, basically.

Jarrad 3:15

Yeah, okay. I was looking at the looking at how you did it. I'm interested to know the route because did you go did you lap or did you go back to back and forwards?

Matt 3:26

I went back and forth. So the yeah, I guess I did it the normal way and then backwards, and then the normal way, then backwards, and yeah.

Jarrad 3:36

Okay. And when you I I don't remember where I saw it, whether it was on social media or whatever, but the the fifth lap, why why the fifth lap?

Matt 3:48

So two years ago I did it back to back to back, and then ever since then it's kind of been on my mind, could I do four? Yeah. Uh so it took me a couple years to come back and to give it a shot, and that's what I did last week. And at the start of the fourth lap, I wasn't feeling too bad, and then when you kind of do do big missions, there's always highs and lows, and often the highs are super high, the lows can be super low. Yeah. But you know, on those highs you start to like think, Oh, could I do this, could I do that? So schemed up the idea, could I do five? And it definitely wasn't like I committed to it then. It was like, you know, if I finish four and I feel good, maybe we go for five, and then I finished the fourth, which was meant to be the finish, and I I still felt okay. Yeah. So you know, it it takes so much effort and time to even get to the point to attempt a fifth. Yeah. So if I didn't give it a shot, I wouldn't have been able to live with myself. So I went and gave the fifth lap a shot and managed to get it done.

Jarrad 4:54

Yeah, right. Yeah, it's I've definitely been in that position many times where I'm like on this insane high three-quarters of the way through a ride, and you're like, Alright, yeah, I'm good, I'm good. And then you just hit this low, and it's like almost like you're in the darkest room in the world, it's insane. But the whole reason I wanted to get you on is to chat about this type of stuff and this type of riding, because I don't know if there's many people out there that actually understand what it's like to ride for like 15 hours straight, you know, like three, four hours, yes, like it's a big mission, and and for some people like that's gonna be huge, but then when you then times that by quite a lot, like it's I just feel like it's just such a different headspace to be in, and as you say, those highs and lows, I feel like they get further apart the further you go into the ride. Do you find that?

Matt 5:46

Um I think it changes, you know. I think you sit on this tipping point, and for me it's not consistent. The highs can can last for hours or they could last for minutes. Um, same with the lows, but I think no matter what side you're on, um I'm always aware that it's not gonna last forever. Yeah. So yeah, especially when it sucks, it's not gonna suck forever. There will be a high after that, or at least you hope so anyway. Um that's what I tell myself. So I always just keep pushing on.

Jarrad 6:19

Yeah, eventually it has to end, whether you choose to end or the actual ride finishes for sure.

New Zealand Roots And First Big Goal

Jarrad 6:25

So I want to go back to the beginning a little bit and work out where it started for you, like growing up in New Zealand and things like that. Whereabouts in New Zealand were you growing up?

Matt 6:35

Um, so I've lived in the South Island my whole life. Um until about five or six we lived, kind of added some farmland, had a bit of land, um, and then when I was yeah, about five or six kind of moved towards the city and kind of yeah, lived the that kind of life until I found bikes at about ten. Um yeah.

Jarrad 7:01

Yeah. And then what got you into the bikes? Was it like parents and stuff like that, or just mucking around with friends or so?

Matt 7:08

My oldest sibling who's a few years older than me, he got into the high school mountain bike club. Yeah. Um, and then he pulled my dad into it, who used to mountain bike. Um, so they both got into it, and then uh I I followed basically. I'm quite competitive with my family. I always want to be the best. So I guess that's why maybe I took it up. I wanted to kind of get involved and and be better than them and and show them up.

Jarrad 7:37

Yeah, for sure. And then that was what you said around 10 years old, and then you started progressing through that. When you you did quite a big ride, what when you were 17, 18? Is that sort of where these bigger rides started to click, or were you doing them even younger than that?

Matt 7:55

Um, I think the first big one was when I was 15. Yeah. Uh that was maybe the beginning of COVID, uh, and that's when a lot of kind of uphill challenges started to to take off online, and I guess I wasn't doing much. I wasn't at school because of COVID. Yeah. Uh had a lot of time to myself, a lot of time in my own head, and thought, yeah, why don't I do that? And didn't think why I couldn't do that, so yeah, went and did it.

Jarrad 8:27

Yeah, right. Um so like what ride was that? Like when you say that was one of your bigger first rides, like what did that differ from the other rides?

Matt 8:36

Um, so that big one was climbing the height equivalent of the tallest mountain in the world, so that is just under 9,000 metres. Yeah. Uh and I guess that was the first time I'd actually maybe set a goal distance or height wise. Yeah. Um, and yeah, I mean, and maybe I'd I'd done four or five hours before that, but never kind of pushed, you know, into into what what is is quite big, I suppose. Yeah.

Jarrad 9:10

And what did your your parents think of that?

Matt 9:13

Um yeah, maybe I'm not too sure. I they're definitely supportive, but I think they have to be. I'm quite stubborn and I don't like being told no. Okay. Um, so I think they knew if they didn't support that I was gonna go and do it anyway. Yeah, but I was better to have their support and their guidance uh with me to help me achieve that than just doing it alone and you know taking a bigger chance in that aspect?

Jarrad 9:46

Yeah. Did you find in that sort of first one, and maybe you don't remember as much? Because I know in my own rides I've definitely blanked out a lot of stuff. Do you find in some of that first ride that you felt some different things you hadn't felt on rides in the way of like different emotions and different things like that coming up, or is it not you don't really remember too much?

Matt 10:08

Yeah, not too much clicks to be honest. Yeah, um, which is maybe why I keep coming back to these things. Like, not yeah, I I feel like I've done quite a lot of things now, and not much has sunk into my head and has has stayed there. I often forget and just move on.

Riding Between World Cup Rounds

Jarrad 10:25

Yeah. So then I guess moving forwards a little bit, where did the idea for the Enduro racing and riding between those events come in?

Matt 10:35

Um I guess I've always been quite competitive, and I guess at home the evolution of just being competitive, kind of moving, moving up each year to the bigger events uh domestically and nationally. Uh eventually it kind of led to me wanting to head overseas. Yeah. And being, I guess, 16. Yeah, I was 16 at the time, and the EWS, now the EDR, was meant to come to New Zealand, and that was my big goal I was working towards. Uh then COVID cancelled that two years back to back, and you know, that goal was taken away, and I felt like I had nothing to work towards. So I shifted that goal to then being heading overseas to do the the EWS, uh, which was a big step up, you know, uh living in New Zealand on the other side of the world, and having no connections overseas, not much money, I guess. Um just being that young and you know, I'm so stubborn. Like if I want something, if I want to make something happen, I'm gonna make it happen. And um basically at 17 I I booked the plane ticket over there, plane ticket back, and the in-between I hadn't hadn't worked out, uh, didn't have much money, and I had a couple months over there. And the plan was to kind of meet some people over there, jump in someone's van, ideally, and get to to all the World Cups that way. But I got to the first World Cup in Scotland, and basically I was just super shy, talked to no one, uh, ended up bumping into Win Masters though, who that was who's also a fellow Kiwi. Uh that was the first time I'd met him, first time he'd met me and heard of me, and I was telling him I didn't know how to get to the next World Cup, and he was saying, Oh, you should bike there. And you know, that talking of win, um, I guess being a young Kiwi, you know, he's like an idol, yeah, he's a big figure, and I felt felt like I couldn't say no, so I said, Yep, yeah, I'll do that. Um, and you know, he thought I was joking, and the next World Cup was in Slovenia. Uh, I hadn't even looked at a map to see how far away that was. Like I I knew it was far, obviously, but not 1.8,000 kilometres far. Um, and you know, I told him yes, and kind of when I say I'm gonna do something, I'm committed. Yeah, and before even looking at a map or whatever, I was committed to the idea and I I made it happen. It solved my issue of not having a way to get there, and yeah, I I was there for the journey, so when I got that one done too.

Jarrad 13:25

Was that the one? And I just remember reading somewhere in those early days that you rode some ridiculous distance within a week, like the the races were like a week back to back, or maybe a week, two weeks back to back, or something like that. And you rode one of the days was like a 350 kilometre day or something like that in between the races. Was that that early on, or was that a bit later on? Do you remember?

Matt 13:50

I think that was at the end of that season. Uh yeah, I think it was I had five days. There's a World Cup in Switzerland, and then five days later it was a World Cup in Loudinville, and it was yeah, a little bit over a thousand kilometers. Yeah. So I was putting in like about 16 to 20 hours shifts each day to make it there on time.

Jarrad 14:12

And back then, like, did you split your gear up? Were you carrying all of your gear? Because I know at one point you'd swapped onto like road tyres and things like that, but did you do that from the beginning, or how did you set the bike up to ride between the events?

Matt 14:28

Um, I guess it was quite simple. I had had almost no gear. Um, but I worked out and also I guess people wanted to help me out as much as they could, which I was quite fortunate by. But I worked out that at the World Cups all the teams would take off their tyres uh like you know after one day of use and I'd just chuck them behind their tents and their pit setups. Yeah. So I'd get to these World Cups and I'd go and scavenge for tyres, which we use but basically new. Yeah. Uh and at that first World Cup in Scotland, uh, Wen had helped me saw some slick tires, so I managed to keep those slick tires all season and yeah, swap them out for the commutes.

Jarrad 15:13

Yeah, nice. And then just like carry all your your camping gear and and everything else on the bike.

Matt 15:19

Yeah, yeah, exactly. I mean, I I barely had any camping gear anyway, so it was quite simple, just a few changes of clothes and full face, half-face, and yeah, no cooking equipment, just kept it quite light.

Jarrad 15:32

Yeah. Did you have much support from sponsors or anything on that first one?

Matt 15:37

Um, that first year, no. Uh domestically I'd support, but overseas, no. Um, although deviate cycles, who unfortunately kind of are no longer the same, or yeah, yeah, they've had some some tough times, you know. Yeah um, but at the start, yeah, they they helped kit me out with some some gear to help bitepack uh since that wasn't the plan. So the owner Ben, he he went and bought me some bikepacking bags and kitted me out for that. So it was a big help at the start, um, and obviously useful since the uh located in in Scotland as well. Yeah. So yeah, that all worked out quite well.

Jarrad 16:19

Yeah, nice. And what was it like going from like let's call it small town New Zealand? Because realistically it is like a when you compare it to some of the other spots in the world, it's like almost like a country town. But how does that feel when you were going from there into some of these places in Europe? How's that for you?

Matt 16:41

Um I guess the thing that stands out is the language. Yeah. Like that first year I was so shy and so scared, which is basically why I ended up in the situation of commuting between all these World Cups anyway. But I was just scared to go into shops, scared to talk to people. I just avoided people. Um, so I was quite isolated that first year. Uh definitely a lot better now, a lot more comfortable, but I think that first year helped me kind of spend time with myself and be super self self-sufficient just because I yeah, I didn't want to deal with anyone. Uh but also the other big thing is that it's so densely populated, you're never far away. There's always a town, yeah, there's always something. Uh whereas in New Zealand it's it's all quite sparse. So in a way, even though I wasn't wanting to deal with anyone, it was quite comfortable knowing that like worst case, there's there's always kind of some type of civilization close by.

Jarrad 17:48

Yeah, yeah, exactly. It's not as you say, like New Zealand's very much like spotted towns throughout the islands versus as you say Europe, it's like every couple of kilometers there's a new little town somewhere down the road for sure. But yeah, interesting about the language, because like I've done a little bit of travel through Europe and it's just traveling by yourself is so nerve-wracking when you've got to walk into like even like something simple, like a bakery, and they you just have no idea how to even ask for like a piece of bread or a donut or whatever, you know, like pretty wild to think about back then for

Racing Or Adventure Picking A Path

Jarrad 18:25

you. So um when did the like sort of talking about racing versus uh the adventure side of things, is that something you've always tried to mix, or is it do you find that you're starting to separate that a little bit in the sense of what your focus and your goals are?

Matt 18:47

Yeah, um well I'd say the core of it all is like chasing that feeling, you know, that that satisfaction, and for me that comes out of always getting better um and pushing myself, and it doesn't exactly have to be a certain form of anything, as long as I feel like I'm moving forward, I you know, getting that feeling that's what I'm chasing. So I guess initially that was by competing in these events and pushing my abilities uh in a skill aspect, I guess. Yeah. And then doing all these commutes between the World Cups kind of flared up this other side of how far can I pedal? Um, you know, how how d big of a day can I do. So then I started to have these both of these things like side by side simultaneously, and yeah it got to a point where like I kind of plateaued with both of them. Yeah. I think because I wasn't giving either one enough focus. Um so then I almost I felt like to keep moving forward and to keep finding that feeling, I had to pick one or the other. Um and for me I found well I thought there were more opportunities with the adventure and the long distance um and that side of thing. And I feel like there was maybe more to explore, like there was it was gonna be maybe harder to find a plateau because there was always somewhere new to go to, and I feel like I could shape that path a lot more than chasing the World Cup circuit.

Jarrad 20:24

Yeah, yeah, because you did the World Cups for what, like three years? Was it three years? You kind of on and off a little bit, and then um and then this year, because what would that be like 22, 23, or 24, I guess? Exactly, yeah, yeah.

Matt 20:40

Did the full season each of those years?

Jarrad 20:42

Yeah. And did all three years you ride between the events?

Matt 20:45

I did, yeah.

Jarrad 20:45

Yeah, okay. I wasn't sure in the third year if you did that or not, or if you had other support and things, but um just jumping back on that as a full question that popped into my head, what was the attention like as that sort of story grew for you? Like obviously more and more people are like getting in contact and like you're getting a bit more sponsorship, getting a bit more support. How was that changing throughout the years as you're continuing to do essentially the same type of thing with riding between all the events? Did that change much for you in that that style?

Matt 21:20

Yeah, totally. I guess the first year there was this massive buzz, a lot of excitement, a lot of talk, and that led to a lot of opportunities. Uh so jumped on as many of those as I could, and then heading into the second year, uh, I guess a lot of the sponsorship talks were to continue that, uh continue bikepacking in that second year. But I guess in a way you could look at it as more at that point, it was more work, it was more doing it for the support and the attention, like with the goal of you know getting attention and getting some visibility for sponsors and Partners and and so on. And like I definitely did still want to do it. Um but I guess yeah, there's always the the the juggle of invisibility and sponsors and all that. Um so yeah, I mean that second year still went still went good. There was a lot to juggle, uh, but there was less buzz. Um but I'd say that was still still successful. And then going to the third year, I guess doing the same thing again for the third time, there was even less less buzz, and I was maybe not doing the the best job of getting that visibility in terms of maybe making content and so on, and that third year felt a bit pointless, maybe, or less so, there was less value in it. Um, and I definitely felt like I needed to change something. Um, whether that was change paths or focus more on content, um, but it also maybe felt less genuine at that point, so yeah.

Tour Du Mont Blanc By Bike

Jarrad 23:01

Yeah, that was definitely what I was gonna ask you, is like as like you repeat yourself so many times, obviously it's gonna just feel like exactly that, that it's just a repetition versus finding that new adventure. And then I know you did uh like an FKT on Mont Blanc um and a couple other things. Was that like trying to reach into that new world a little bit of like trying different things?

Matt 23:27

Yeah, yeah, exactly. That was just kind of giving something something a go. Uh in my eyes, there was no consequence with that with that one. Uh it was a cool concept. Um, yeah, doing a a lap of Mont Blanc, circumnavigating it, uh and yeah, there's some good biking and yeah, insane mountain, of course.

Jarrad 23:48

Yeah.

Matt 23:49

And yeah.

Jarrad 23:50

How was that? Because I remember watching the video, and like you can go into a bit of detail here, but like it just seems so insane. And then at the same time, well, within reason, the same time, same year, my fiance went and did it as a hike over the space of I think it was 10 days or something like that. But watching you do it on the bike, I'm like, that is such a sick idea. Like, I didn't even know you could ride around it, let alone like do it in the way you did it. But how was that for you?

Matt 24:18

Yeah, so it's a it's a popular hike. Um and it is a hike, I'd say. Uh biking, there was a lot of hike a bike. Uh but for me that was quite exciting. Like, I the thing which excites me the most in mountain biking is the technical aspect, it's getting into the mountains and kind of pushing the limits physically and technically, and yeah, that definitely did that. Um and I don't think anyone had ever kind of gone and did the full loop on a mountain bike in one go. So that was quite exciting to see if I could get it done. And yeah, um I mean it's it's a few years ago now, it feels a bit it feels a bit lost in my head, but that was I'd say, yeah, definitely what kind of started uh this this kind of chain of of wanting to to kind of do new big challenges and and new places.

Jarrad 25:14

Yeah. I wanna wanna say that I remember when you uh you drank the water or whatever it was and then you had like the worst stomach ache and like throwing up and stuff. I'm like that sounds like the most classic like country town New Zealand guy just drinking the water. Because I feel like in Australia it's the same, it's like when there's running water, you just drink it. And I feel like here and Europe for that matter, everyone's so scared about drinking the water from the streams. Like I just thought that was like one of the funniest things, especially talking to all the boys, and they're like, Oh, did you see me drink the water? And I'm like, Yeah, dude, that's normal. So, but yeah, that's kind of kind of funny. But uh, so moving forwards from from that with the like that ride and and things like that, and that sort of opened a couple of doors, I guess, with a bit more visibility on content and that type of thing, was it?

Matt 26:07

Yep, yeah, definitely. So I guess out of that big big challenge, there was a video uh and I'd say it went quite successful, especially for the investment that that went into it. Like I edited that video, um, had some help filming it, of course, but yeah, like in terms of what we got out of it for the investment, it went super well, and it definitely kind of made me think, oh, what what potential is in this moving forward um in this space? Like, could I do a few of these things a year? And at that time, I guess I was still focused on doing the world cups. That was still where I wanted to succeed, but I felt maybe juggling kind of these big challenges and the world cups, there was more opportunity for support to kind of help me, I guess, fuel that lifestyle and to get to these events, so yeah, somewhat doubled down on that, but didn't lose the the idea of competing on the World Cup scene.

Jarrad 27:08

Yeah, and then

Self-Supported Enduro Week And The Win

Jarrad 27:10

last year, so like what were you doing last year in the way of racing and stuff, or did you not do much racing?

Matt 27:17

Um, I yeah, barely did any. Um, but it wasn't the plan. I was meant to do half of the World Cup season, but then the first half of the yeah, I injured myself back to back. I did I I did my scapula and then tore the UCL on my thumb. Yeah. So that took me out until basically July. Uh and I was meant to do the first half of the World Cup season. So yeah, last year was meant to be a 50-50 split with the first half of the year focused on the World Cups, and then the second half focused on some big long distance challenges, but yeah, in the end, kind of had to miss out on that World Cup season.

Jarrad 27:57

Yeah. So what were some of the bigger ones you did last year? Um, good question. What happened last year? Uh because was the what was the what year did you do the what I've got it written down here? Oh, it's 2024. You did the New Zealand in Juro where you like kayaked and everything like that. That was pretty wild.

Matt 28:16

Yeah, yeah, I think that's yeah, that was definitely one of my peaks. Um yeah, still can't believe like how well that went to plan. Um so yeah, six-day event. I think there was there was almost 30 stages. Uh all the I guess the normal computers you could say uh were getting it was an assisted event basically, so all catered for. Um they got accommodation each night, feed each night, and then for that 80% of the liaisons, they were getting a bus, a shuttle, a helicopter. Um, you know, they had it, they had it quite good, but I came up with the idea to do it all self-supported. So when they were in the helicopter, I'd be hiker-biking up the mountains. When they were in the bus commuting between the days and the stages, I'd be biking, and when they were they were shuttling, I'd be climbing up the hills. Uh, and there was even a a boat charter in there. So when they were on the boat, I was gonna be kayaking over the bay. Uh, and yeah, despite all that, I still somehow managed to take the win. Yeah. Which is yeah, even I can't can't believe it to be honest.

Jarrad 29:28

And like there was some solid names in the race too. I can't remember who the riders were off the top of my head now, but I remember thinking, like, it wasn't even that it was an easy win either, like it was there were some solid guys in there for sure.

Matt 29:42

Yeah, yes, some some fast Kiwis, some you know, heaps of fast international people. Uh Matt Beer, who works at Pink Bike. Yeah, that's you know, he's a X-Canadian downhill champ. Um yeah, he's he's not slow. He was he was there, managed to beat him. He was he made on the podium, and yeah, yeah, it's so how does the logistics work for something like that?

Jarrad 30:07

Like, obviously, you've got certain times that the race stages are open. Um, so you can't get there at like 4 a.m. in the morning and do stage one to then make it through the rest of the day. Like, how did you work that out logistically? Was that something that you sat down and worked out, okay, I need to like ride X amount of distance in this time to get to each of these stages, or how did that look?

Matt 30:32

Yeah, so basically I had a meeting with the event organizer um to get their permission to do this, obviously, and they were like, Yep, you can do it, but we aren't going to alter anything for you. You've got to stick to our times. Um, and if you don't make it there, you know, tough, tough luck, you know. Um so essentially what I had to do is I had to be I had to make sure that I was the first one to start stage one of the day. So I'd start super early, get to the top of stage one before all the others got there, or you know, ideally as close to when they when they got there, um, because that's when the the marshal, the start marshal would get there. So yeah, I'd be the be the first or you know one of the first people to get down in stage one, and then that was kind of when the game started. Then it was full gas to keep up with with all the others whilst they were shuttling. Um usually there'd be a few stages in the morning and then lunch, which for me worked out quite well. They'd you know stop for maybe 90 minutes for lunch, which would give me time to catch up again because slowly I'd be falling towards the back of the pack. Um and then yeah, after lunch, again, ideally I'd be further up the field, starting with the the first bunch of people, and then again slowly move back as the the stages in the afternoon went on. Um, and I managed to make all the stages all week, which honestly at the start of the week I had no clue if that was possible. Didn't know how things would work out. Um it was just a big gamble. Took the chance and it it worked out in the end, and then at the end of each each day was the commute to the next day's location. Um, so that would basically be biking for most of the night to to make it to the next day's.

Jarrad 32:31

Um so how did that's another question I've got is like some of these bigger rides, are you enjoying the like process of how like the logistics of the ride and the the mapping and and things like that? Is that something that you enjoy with some of these bigger projects?

Matt 32:49

Yeah, definitely. I'd say a lot of the enjoyment I get is coming up with a goal and working towards it. I think the actu actual doing of the goal, of the challenges, I definitely get a lot of enjoyment out of that, but it's not the full picture. Yeah, it's it's kind of yeah, working towards something, and I love the feeling of taking boxes, chasing a goal. Yeah. Um, yeah, that's that's definitely what motivates me a lot.

Jarrad 33:19

Okay, yeah, as I say, it's something that I know with some of my own bigger rides, it's like exactly that. It's that like process of like, okay, I think I can do

Highs Lows And The Solo Mindset

Jarrad 33:30

whatever it may be, X amount, and then it's okay, how does that physically look and how does that work? And then as you say, like ticking all those boxes is is I guess a r a good way of explaining it in that sense. I want to ask you a bit more about like the mental aspect of it and how how that comes across. I know we kind of touched on a little bit earlier, but in the sense of like the highs and lows and and what you're doing throughout the ride, like um the the ride that you just did recently over in Korea, that was what uh 15 15 hours moving, I think it was, or something along those lines.

Matt 34:08

I think it was close to 20.

Jarrad 34:11

Was it okay, maybe yeah, maybe it was 18 moving 20 total or something like that. Um but yeah, like when you're going through a ride like that, how does that feel? Like what are you what are you going into the ride feeling, how are you feeling throughout the ride? Just run me through some of those thoughts.

Matt 34:31

Um well yeah, uh I think I do my best not to put any weight on these things. Like, I like to believe you can dictate your own feelings and you get to choose how you feel, and I often tell myself that going into something and make myself aware that you get to choose how you feel, and I don't get nervous, I don't get excited, it's just a normal day. Yeah. Like I've you know, I go biking each day of the week, and when I go onto a a big mission, you know, nothing changes. I'm just doing the same thing I usually would, but a little bit longer. Yeah. Um and I'm just gonna take a little bit more food than I usually would, and you know, maybe there's a few more logistics, but there usually usually is when I go biking each day. Like I'm in new places all the time, and you know, nothing's nothing's consistent anyway, so there's always something to think about. Um and the same goes with these missions. So yeah, there's there's no no big emotion, no big feeling. I just kind of go and go and do it. Yeah. And things are often quite normal. I'd say on a normal week to week I wouldn't do more I wouldn't spend more than four hours on the bike a day. Um and then after the four, five hour mark on these bigger missions, um, which I things just kind of simplify. Often that's when I maybe zone out, like my mind is quite active up until that that four, five hour mark, and then then things start to zone out, you get into the flow, but you kind of find your place, and yeah, time disappears at that point until you you bonk and hit a low. But but yeah, it it all gets quite simple.

Jarrad 36:25

Yeah, yeah, I'd have to agree, and it's like I feel like that it's actually a pretty interesting thing that you say that sort of five-hour point, because I feel much the same in the sense of that first few hours. I'm always like calculating numbers in my head. I'm like looking at my screen, I'm like, alright, I'm doing this, I've got this, I need to tick this off by this point, and then those thoughts kind of slow down. I don't know for my s like for you, but for myself, I don't know if I ever stop thinking about that type of stuff and like sort of forecasting when I'm gonna get to certain points within the ride that I know I've set sort of goals for, but I also feel that like they kind of happen less frequently, if that makes sense. Um and one thing I want to ask is like, how do you deal with being solo? Because I on any of these longer rides, I prefer riding solo just because I don't have to match anyone's pace, I don't have to share like any social energy or anything like that. I'm just like headphones in, whether I'm listening to a podcast or music or whatever it may be, it might be like 2 a.m. in the morning, but I'm just like in the rhythm of pedaling and just like cruising, you know. Like, how's that for you being solo a lot of these times?

Matt 37:42

Um, yeah, for me also, I definitely prefer to be solo. I think I guess on a whole, um definitely quite an individual person, um, quite happy by myself. I'm not someone who gets much energy off of people. Um, obviously I like spending time with people and all that, but it's it's never like I need it or it doesn't motivate me. I'm quite happy with just kind of ticking along by myself. Um and I'd say it's definitely on the on the mental side. Uh I think it just allows me to kind of be flexible and to to adapt as things are are coming up and um yeah, I think it's it's also just nice to have that time and space with yourself to to think and digest, and I think there's a lot more you more you can take away um on some aspects with that.

Jarrad 38:40

Yeah, I got two questions for that because one of them, or the first one I'm thinking about, is um sort of that suffering, and a lot of people talk about like these bigger rides and like the suffer aspect of it. I almost find it easier with the the suffering aspect of when you are in the lows, you kind of can work through it in your own head, and you don't have to be like conscious of somebody else and like annoying somebody else as such because I feel like that's almost the worst when you are bonking and someone else is like, Hey, it's good, like we're gonna be sweet, blah blah blah. Like, I feel like that makes it even worse for myself. Like, is that something that you've one? I guess have you ever ridden with other people on some of these mega rides? And two is like, how do you feel with some of that suffering that goes along with some of the lows?

Matt 39:32

Um, I guess, yeah, maybe to start off, I'll go with uh like just yeah, having someone else there. I think I think that's a good point, and it's like you know, if you're in a bad mood and then someone maybe sees that and they're like overly positive, that can definitely make things worse. So sure. Uh, but I don't think I've ever bonked with someone, yeah. Um, or at least if I have, I've put on you know a tough face and just got it on with it. Yeah. Um yeah, I I think being solo, you have all the time in the world to to work those things out, and there's not someone chirping at you, and in my eyes that makes it a little bit easier. Uh and yeah, I think that's that's just also how I've always done it, to be honest.

Jarrad 40:21

Yeah. Yeah, I'm trying to remember what my second question was now, and I've completely mental blanked on it as we started to go into that. But that's right.

Matt 40:28

How do I how do I cope when it gets tough or yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jarrad 40:32

How how like what are some of the things you when you mentioned earlier, like you know that towards the end of the ride, or sorry, through the lows, you know at some point you're gonna get through that and hopefully out the other side. Like, what are some of those, like, let's call them coping mechanisms almost that you work through with that? Like, I know for myself that I am as long as I continue to pedal, at some point something's gonna change my mood, or I'm gonna forget about why I'm so annoyed or upset, and then eventually I'll I feel like it'll come out. Um, and I'm trying to think about how I would say this or or do this verbally because it's just I feel like such a mental thing. Like, have you got anything that you do actively to like change that mental aspect and like reframe what you're thinking?

Matt 41:25

Yeah, so I think the foundation of my thinking is that it's always going to get better, um, you know, your mood always sways. So that's the foundation. But I think to kind of help me to get to that point of pushing past the suffer to get to that next mood swing to when things get better, I set many goals, and it's like get to the top of that mountain, and you know, as as the challenge goes on, as it gets tougher and as the mood swings happen more and more often, those those goals get smaller. So at the start it might be get to that next mountain top, get to the peak, and then it could be get to that corner, yeah. Um, and then if it gets super bad, like I don't know, get do do one more kilometer, do half a kilometre. Yeah. And it's just kind of yeah, taking those taking off those small goals, and even if they're small, you kind of maybe get a little bit of satisfaction out of it, and you're still moving forward, which I think is is always the the big key to to getting these these challenges and missions done, as long as you're moving forward, you're you know, you're you're one step closer. Basically, yeah, exactly.

Jarrad 42:40

Yeah, I'd I'd have to agree. Like, I know it's something that whenever I've ridden with other people that have been struggling, and I know we just mentioned like the worst thing is having someone super positive beside you, but um it's like as long as you can keep that train rolling, even if it's at half the speed of what you actually want to be riding at, at some point like your body's gonna pick itself back up and and keep going. Have you ever got to a point on some of these rides where you've had to stop and you're like I'm fully cooked right now?

Matt 43:14

Um I mean there's there's been moments and I think the thing is with me is I'm so stubborn, I'd I'd never let myself give up. But in saying that there, you know, there are moments where at that point in time I've given up my all and I've got to stop for one moment, but yeah, then I get in my head and you know, I tell myself some things and I'll maybe set myself a time like you've got five minutes, um chill out and forget about it, and then I often kind of think of it as at that point is like a a new day, you know. I'm starting again, and I'll for do my best to forget about what I've done or you know the past, and when I get that bike you know that's kind of kilometer one you know yeah um it yeah that that's that's the start um just so you know like if you look at these these big challenges and missions as is what they are um you look at the total distance the total elevation it's it's overwhelming but I think if you kind of segment it up especially once it gets hard um you can always you can always climb like another a thousand a thousand metres so I'll often yeah forget about the the five thousand meters I've done or whatever and be like okay like yeah we've got a thousand metres that's a normal day just go and get it done this is this is the start yeah it doesn't matter what you've done before we're just doing a normal day now yeah I definitely feel the same in some of the like harder moments I'm like alright if I can just push 30k's like that's my regular commute to work I do that every day I'm sure I can make 30k's happen

Growth Through Culture And Discomfort

Matt 45:00

and then it's like alright cool done and then you get to that next point and 30ks for most people is over an hour and when you think about how much your life changes in an hour it's like you're usually forgotten about why you're upset like yeah it's pretty funny. And you've always got another hour. Yeah I think that's that's what you'll work out yeah you think you don't but then you do and it's like oh yeah yeah what else is there?

Jarrad 45:22

Yeah definitely have you found uh and it maybe you don't have much of an idea on this but have you found as you're doing these longer rides and you're learning about yourself and things like that um like has that sort of brain and that thought pattern like transferred into like regular decision making? I know with myself that a lot of people call me a plus two minus two in my emotion range and I stay very like calm and stable and just not overly excited but not overly upset. And I think a lot of it has to do with these type of rides where you almost need to find that balance a little bit. Do you find that in yourself?

Matt 46:08

Yeah yeah it's um exactly the same with that way of thinking um but I think I've also gotten quite well a lot better than I was in the past at focusing on what I can do instead of what I can't do. So you know if you make a mistake or something happens it's not I I don't get caught up on that as much anymore as I would in the past it's just about focusing on what I can do to fix that or what I can do to keep moving forward and yeah just not not getting stuck on on whatever happened before because oftentimes you can't you know it's happened you can't change it. Exactly you've just got to do what you can to make that situation better.

Jarrad 46:50

Yeah so talking a bit about like culture and and things like that especially with like the adventure world how has that changed your own riding like as you say you've kind of started to trend in this direction where there's a bit more of like these adventures new countries new riding spots things like that has that changed your outlook on riding like I know you're you're pretty much like happy to ride anything you just got off the gravel bike you've ride mountain bikes all of the above like how does that change over the years for you um I think yeah good good question I'm not too sure I just feel like I just I just go biking but I think I've been a little bit inspired lately by pushing myself more as a person especially in the adventure sense.

Matt 47:44

I think as I touched on before my first time overseas I wouldn't I wouldn't put myself out there and speak to people or avoid going going to shops because that meant I had to talk to someone but now I'm doing my best to push myself out of my comfort zone as a person. The past few years it's been all about the physical aspect but now for me I want to develop as a person and kind of yeah see how I can push myself on that side of things push myself into situations that scare me and that's a lot of what I'm chasing with the adventure side of things and visiting new places and just putting myself out there essentially yeah.

Jarrad 48:28

Yeah definitely and I think I I just watched your like Korea vlog if you wanted to call it that um and it's like you're talking about like going into new new restaurants and like they're talking you into buying desserts and stuff like that type of thing and I'm like that definitely seems like what you're talking about in that like opening yourself up like obviously yes the writing is is huge and massive in that sense but the ability to feel the culture and be in the world and just be I guess in the now versus like what is actually happening day to day for your writing aspect I guess in that sense.

Matt 49:07

Yeah definitely yeah yeah I think I've isolated myself so much over the past few years I've been lucky enough to go to some amazing places but I haven't I haven't lived a lot of them. Yeah you know I just stick to myself I do my own thing and you know that's cool but there's so much more opportunities out there I think if you put yourself out there and I think I'm starting to learn that a bit more and the more I open myself up the more things come my way and the more the more I get to live these opportunities I think.

Jarrad 49:40

Yeah for sure have you and this is something that just popped into my head is have you ever um spoken or like done much with Lochelon Morton? I feel like he's gone on a a pretty similar adventure alternate calendar kind of quest over the past few years and um things like that. Have you ever done much with him at all or even thought about that?

Matt 50:04

Um haven't done anything with him. I think he I've definitely followed him over the past few years and I wouldn't I wouldn't say I get inspired by people but I think his concepts I've definitely taken bits and pieces out of um and yeah I can maybe see myself kind of fitting you know fitting his style and kind of applying it to to my style a little bit. Yeah. Definitely more so in the mountain bike world but but yeah I think yeah he definitely get it gets up to come up to some cool stuff and he's you know at an insane level as an athlete. Yeah and I think there's a lot a lot I can take away off of him.

Jarrad 50:49

Yeah it was just something as I say that just popped into my head and I'm like yeah like he's done obviously he's doing all the lifetime Grand Prix he's done the the tours the road tours and things like that in the past and then obviously some of these insane uh like mega adventures and and things like that and a lot of FKTs and um I just remember when he he did the like tour de France but almost like how you were talking about doing the New Zealand enduro and he did it fully self-supported and and things like that. So yeah it was just an interesting thing that I was like oh yeah I didn't even think about that when I was doing the research but yeah for sure. Um I kind of fully lost my train of thought there where we were going with that. Oh uh in the sense of like your filming and and editing and and that type of thing how does that work when you're doing things like an FKT um and then obviously your general vlogging that's obviously a little bit easier but are you sort of trying to film along uh like the route when you're like reconning the route or are you how does that work when you do that type of stuff?

Matt 51:59

Um so yeah that one you were just just talking about uh I basically had two weeks overseas um and I bytepacked the whole length of what was going to be the FKT so I took yeah one week to bytepack the F the FKT uh course I guess you could call it and along the way there I was filming as if it was the FKT attempt. So same clothes same setup all that um and third person shots and all that because of course when you're chasing a a fast time you're not going to be stopping to film yourself and set up all these third person shots where you're you know you you set up your phone or whatever and then you go bike 10 meters back and then 10 meters back the other way you know you you just wouldn't you'd be wasting hours. So yeah film filmed all the footage the week before and then for the FKT itself I just didn't film well only 10% of the footage I filmed all the pair of V stuff I filmed on the bike on the FKT attempt and that didn't slow me down I guess you could say maybe took a little bit of mental energy but it also distracted you from what you're doing as well. Yeah and I mean I guess where where I'm at as well is I've got to I've got to think about how I can like I I guess I want to fuel this this lifestyle and I've got to think about how can I do that. Yeah um and to be able to do that I've got to put out content I've got to put out something that people can d digest and you know kind of make media for my sponsors so sure maybe it slowed me down five minutes over the course of that time but the value it gave in terms of allowing me to do these things is that's that's what it's fueled um and you know it's worth that five minute penalty or whatever.

Jarrad 53:59

Yeah for sure how like how does that what am I trying to say like when you've got to put those together like how do you balance that with yourself because as you say you've got to try and stay quite genuine to what you want to do but then you've also got the commercial side of it that you have to balance like what are you doing to balance that is that part of that being there for the two weeks to give yourself the time to like do the footage do the the commercial aspect of it but then go and do the actual adventure is that part of that idea or yeah yeah exactly um I think for me a big part of it is so I don't compete in many events in terms of like against other people and I think that's because I I keep things pure to myself like I do the things I want to do I do the things that inspire me and the things I do are because I fully want to do them.

Matt 55:04

So that makes kind of putting in the work alongside that feel much less like actual work. So in that sense it's easy and it doesn't take too much more energy on top of the actual task itself whether yeah whereas I I think maybe if I was doing the same but competing at an event which is is you know set in stone you're kind of on someone else's schedule and all that that takes a lot more energy because it's not exactly how I'd want it to be or the focus isn't put on where I'd want things to be put. So it's m yeah it doesn't feel as exciting to many to me anymore now that I've kind of got the opportunity to choose exactly how I want things to be

Gravel Bikes Numbers And What’s Next

Matt 55:50

if if yeah if that makes sense.

Jarrad 55:52

Yeah for sure no definitely and then before we start to wrap this up I wanted to ask you about the gravel bike because that's sort of new to your world what is it like being on a gravel bike or have you had gravel bikes in the past?

Matt 56:07

Um this is a new opportunity for me. So the past few years I've been supported by DV8 cycles who were awesome to me and yeah they've definitely kind of helped me get to where I've been but I was quite limited in terms of bike choice uh they only had some sort like high pivot mountain bikes like quite focused on descending awesome bikes but as I kind of ventured into this more long distance style and side of biking um there are definitely some limiting factors this year I've been fortunate enough to partner with Kona and I've got access to a a full fleet of bikes and it's opened up some new kind of I guess disciplines and that's been super exciting for me. And again I think it it doesn't matter what I'm doing too much as long as I'm chasing that feeling of getting better and you know finding out what's possible. So these new bikes have kind of allowed me to diversify and chase that feeling in other pathways I haven't been out able to explore before.

Jarrad 57:20

Yeah yeah definitely and I think it's like it's kind of cool that you sort of say that you're just riding a bike at the end of the day and it doesn't matter whether it's drop bars, flat bars, downhill uphill, whatever as long as you're riding a bike I think is like such a cool idea to simplify it like that. And it's it's something I always say is like I'll ride anything I can get my hands on just purely based on like if everybody's going for a mountain bike ride I'll go do that. If everyone's going for a road ride I'll go do that and it's just that aspect of pedaling your bike is is so chill.

Matt 57:55

Yeah yeah I I definitely view bikes as like a tool like I'll come up with an idea and it doesn't matter what bike it is I'll just pick the best tool for the job. Yeah um and yeah like this year with this new opportunity with Kona there's there's so many more tools and I'm now able to like pick a tool and then find out what job that's best for so it's it's quite cool and it's opened up so many new pathways and it's it's made me think of some insane ideas and yeah yeah quite excited about that moving forward.

Jarrad 58:28

Yeah. Can you share any of that stuff or is it pretty hush hush?

Matt 58:32

Um well I I guess it's I've been quite a core mountain biker I'd say the past few years focusing on the descents so now it's maybe kind of also looking at um at what can be done on asphalt on you know stuff which isn't dirt um or you know core mountain biking isn't all focused about the descents so I guess yeah I I I think a big part of what I've the challenges and stuff I've done in the past haven't been focused on numbers in terms of distance or elevation. It's been more about linking mountains together or doing these big loops. Yeah. But now I think having access to these other bikes it's maybe about how far can I bike in a day and less about the the locational mountains as such and it's it's just about yeah doing bigger bigger things and maybe more emphasis on the numbers than it was before.

Jarrad 59:31

Yeah. Are you much of a numbers guy or is it pretty chill when it comes to that like you're not studying okay I need to do X amount this and that or have you started to learn more in whether it be power whether it be stats of the rides fatigue that type of stuff?

Matt 59:48

Definitely getting more into it now but in the past not as much because I think with mountain biking so many things change. Yeah um you know like 10 kilometers in one location isn't the same as 10 kilometers in another location like it could take you one hour or it might take you four hours you know yeah um but now kind of focusing more on the peddling stuff um like yeah using power meters um which has yeah helped out a lot uh and yeah yeah definitely for sure getting a lot more into that than I have been in the past but there's still a lot more learning to go uh and there's also a lot of a lot of holes you can dig there so not wanting to get too caught up with that but definitely using it for some guidance.

Jarrad 1:00:39

Yeah definitely yeah I think like the the number that I always focus on when I'm like looking at my training and and comparing is just the hours.

Matt 1:00:50

It's it's as you say doesn't matter where you're riding mountain bikes road bikes gravel bikes whatever it is at the end of the day an hour on a bike is an hour on a bike and that's like that's the big thing for me like I've got so many roadie friends they're like oh yeah I do 300k's a week I'm like okay cool so you do 10 hours a week and then I'm like I do whatever it is like 40 kilometers on my mountain bike and that's X amount like and that's not to make it a comparison by any means but like that's a I feel like a a fun number to look at as well but yeah um before we wrap this up is there anything else you wanted to to chat about or we I I know we covered a lot yeah um yeah nothing comes to mind yeah yeah I think just still doing it for the love of it which is is awesome and you know despite all these opportunities and getting all these partners I'm you know still still having more fun than ever on the bike and yeah I think that's that's the cool thing like this I think I've developed a lot um at least I like to think so but at its core I'm I'm still the same and still still chasing that that same feeling which yeah which I love yeah yeah nice yeah well thanks for giving us the hour to come and chat because I feel like it's it's not often we get to chat in this way where it's like just talking about some of these insane rides. So yeah thanks for having me and yeah good to explore my own mind a little bit like yeah quite often I just get on with these things myself and you never never dive into it never think much of it so yeah quite a cool opportunity for myself too. Yeah well cheers thank you